Los Tercios según HPS.

Subforo que englobará todos los juegos de la empresa Paradox Interactive:
Crusader king, hoi3, eu4, mount & blade, sword of the stars, majesty....entre otros

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nomada_squadman45
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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Sab Mar 07, 2009 10:49 am

Aaaa vale vale, ya lo entiendo, yo entendia que ya hablaban de una nueva entrega.... si es que me pillo mal dia jejeje por cierto, mas informacion del juego, en este cas todos los escenarios (sin los de campañas) con su descripcion. http://forums.gamesquad.com/blog.php?b=608

PD: ETW instalado, castellanizado y probado, ya me he encontrado con algo raro raro raro :rezar:
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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pailleterie
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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por pailleterie » Sab Mar 07, 2009 3:03 pm

La lista de escenarios es impresionante pero tengo la duda sobre el motor del juego, no se si la adaptación de un juego napoleonico será valida para una época en la que existian unidades de piqueros y espadachines. Si alguien lo juega sus opiniones serian bienvenidas.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por LordSpain » Sab Mar 07, 2009 3:06 pm

Lo que no entiendo es como en pleno siglo XXI sigan sacando esos truños de mapas y figutas con esa calidad. Hay que joderse macho. Yo tiro siempre antes por la jugabilidad y la calidad, pero coño, qué le cuesta a esta peña meter una diseñador gráfico por dios :nono: :nono:
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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Sab Mar 07, 2009 3:13 pm

Es y no es el mismo motor, han añadido cosas para simular la epoca (hay que pedir mas informacion a Rahamy) distintos tipos de unidades y tal.

Hombre, si, graficamente son para :bang: porque los de HPS son unos aguilillas y dejan el tema a modeadores (los que hay para mapas de los napoleonicos son la leche) pero si hay gente que se abstrae para luchar con @ y demas simbolos en el papel de enanos... :mrgreen: lo importante es que la simulacion sea solida :wink:
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Dom Mar 08, 2009 9:51 am

Un poco mas de informacion, pregunte por el tema de los tercios y me han contestado esto:

"A tercio in this game is represented by more than one unit ( in other words a Tercio sort of functions like a brigade in the Napoleonic series). The pike component is only one part... there is a pike component and they can be in either column (for movement -as per you'd expect).. and block formation.

from the game notes:

Quote:
...and a modified square formation called “block” which is capable of offensive melee. The block formation is also capable of pushing back cavalry in a “melee” that doesn’t inflict losses on either side.
Of course nothing can stand up to a pike unit in block formation -and although slow... they are a steam-roller. And they are devastating in melee with those units that don't run away."

Ya se empiezan a ver cosas nuevas para el motor napoleonico :Ok:
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Dom Mar 08, 2009 8:06 pm

Pailleterie, no te acordaras de que tipo de envio pediste a los de duchet no??? es que mirando con envio Europa urgente sale por 1 libra y con todo son 30.99 libras, menos de 35 euros, mas barato que en NWS, parece que son serios pero me interesa el tema del tiempo de espera, a ver si lo encargo mañana, a mas tardar pasado :mrgreen: gracias de antemano.
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por pailleterie » Dom Mar 08, 2009 8:50 pm

Supongo que pedi el envio más barato que es lo que suelo hacer casi siempre :mrgreen:

No estoy seguro de cuanto te tardará porque el pedido se lo hice como hace dos años pero normalmente dentro de Europa Occidental cualquier envio por correo ordinario tarda sobre una semana.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Dom Mar 08, 2009 9:00 pm

Pues gracias por la rapida respuesta, si tal pruebo como va la cosa.

EDITO: va a ser que no, resulta que entrando en la version francesa el rollo es que el juego vale 39 euros + 6 euros de gastos de envio a la Spagne tua points :bang: me quedo con NWS, lento pero seguro y mas barato :mrgreen:
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Lun Mar 09, 2009 12:30 pm

Mas informacion del juego, esta vez lo saque de los foros de wargamer

" While based on the HPS Napoleonic engine, there are various additional elements that will distinguish this new series. The most important of these is a new style of OOB, with movement rates,melee factors & victory point values all modifiable on a unit by unit basis. Other new features include dragoon-type cavalry, gun capture, artillery that requires set up before being able to fire, and a modified square formation called block which is capable of offensive melee. The block formation is also capable of pushing back cavalry in a melee that doesn’t inflict losses on either side.

Thereare a variety of different armies in Renaissance Side A includes France(and French Catholics in the French Wars of Religion), Scotland, Dutch,Ottoman Turks, and also Swiss and Italians. Side B includes Spanish/Imperialists, England, French Huguenots, Mamelukes and also the option of Swiss and Italians. In fact, there are many different armies covered in this title, some of which tend to switch sides, occasionally even mid-campaign. While most scenarios use a standard pdt with similar settings to the Napoleonic series, there is also an alternative pdt which is used for a selection of variant scenarios. The alternative pdt has some enhanced fire factors, notably for firearms, since formations were deep and the tendency was to fire at almost point-blank range at this period. It also imposes no movement penalty for disrupted troops,for a variety of reasons, in particular the fact that disrupted units seem already sufficiently penalized in combat. Also, as has been observed in other titles, a significant result of reduced movement is to make it harder for disrupted than routed units to retreat.Consequently, the alternative pdt will provide quite a difference gaming experience from the standard pdt and will appeal more to gamers who prefer firepower over melee. "

PD: perdon por responderme a mi mismo pero al ser informacion añadida prefiero no editar el post viejo.
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Mar Mar 10, 2009 7:59 pm

Por cierto, me he fijado que en la pagina de HPS se pueden ver mas grandes las imagenes http://www.hpssims.com/Pages/products/M ... n/ren.html

Ya tengo el juego encargado, esta en camino, a ver si los piratas no atacan el galeon en que viene del nuevo mundo :P
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Mié Mar 11, 2009 9:42 am

Mas informacion del juego cortesia de trauth116 de los foros de gamesquad:

I think I'll have to go in and talk more about artillery supply as it works a little differently than in CWB- there is a section in the user guide -which is a different one than the one I am working out of at the moment, also in some cases different nationalities have different ammo rate expenditures.

Troop Types


Cavalry

There are various types of cavalry in Renaissance, some are heavily armoured and intended for shock combat, while others are lighter and more useful for scouting, raiding and skirmishing rather than meleeing.

Gendarmes – heavy, armoured chivalry cavalry armed with lance – excellent shock melee troops. The French invariably have the best quality gendarmes. Other armies, in particular Spanish, English and Scottish, tend to have few, if any, proper heavy cavalry.

Demilancers/ Caballeros – a less heavily armoured and more mobile, yet less effective, lancer type cavalry. Most English and Spanish “heavy” cavalry will fall into this category rather than the above.

“Archers” – less well-armed cavalry armed with lance and crossbow – intended to charge in support of the gendarmes, these troops can also shoot from a distance. Inferior to gendarmes in a melee and rather too slow and heavy to skirmish effectively, these double-armed troops are perhaps second best in both departments, although still pretty effective against most troops in melee.

Reiters/Pistoliers – cuirassier cavalry armed with pistols, appearing from the 1540s onwards and gradually, but never completely, replacing the heavier lancers as the standard heavy cavalry. In the later 16th century, most, if not all, Dutch and Huguenot heavy cavalry are this type, while Spanish and French Catholic forces also retain the lance. Some pistoliers are lighter cavalry without the cuirass.

Stradiots/Ginetes/Coustilliers – light, often irregular, cavalry armed with javelins & shield, good for skirmishing or scouting. Like any cavalry, can ride down infantry skirmishers caught in the open and effective at hunting down routers, but are no match for heavier opponents in a melee. However, their mobility can make them highly effective troops if handled well.

Zagadari – Italian, especially Venetian, cavalry armed with lance and sometimes also crossbow. Apparently a heavier version of the more common Stradiots, these cavalry are effectively the equivalent of the French “archers”.

“Prickers” & Border Horse – light cavalry armed with lance and often also crossbow or firearm. Used primarily as scouts or skirmishers, or for riding down unprotected skirmishers, these troops might also fight dismounted under certain circumstances.

Argoulets/ Escopeteros – these dragoon-type “cavalry”, armed with crossbows or later arquebus, are often really just mounted infantry. Their mobility will make them useful troops, but they should not be used as mounted shock troops.


-Another arm coming later (manually reformatting is something where a little goes a long way... ) (from the Notes.pdf file in the game).


Infantry

Renaissance infantry falls into two basic types: melee and fire. Most, but not all melee infantry are pikemen, while in the early 16th century there are still a range of traditional missile weapons, such as the crossbow and longbow alongside the newer firearms. Only in the later 17th century will the invention of the bayonet effectively turn every infantryman into both a pikeman and a musketeer.

Pike – Pikemen, especially fanatical Swiss, are highly effective melee infantry. They move slower than other foot due to their lengthy weapon and armour. Swiss pikemen tend to be lighter and so are a bit more mobile. When deployed in block formation (the equivalent of Napoleonic square, but with the ability to melee attack), pikemen can hold even the heaviest cavalry at bay. But, lacking firepower, they are best used in combination with missile-armed infantry.

Halberd / Bill – The halberd, and also the English bill, was a heavy pole-arm originally derived from agricultural or hedging implements. There were various types of halberd, such as gisarme, fouchard, bardiche, glaive and corseque, often varying in shape and style from region to region, although all were variations on the combination of spear & axe. Most of these halberd family of weapons would have both a point for stabbing and a heavy blade for chopping, while some also have hammers for crushing or spikes or hooks for dragging cavalry from their saddles. By the early 16th century, most armies - apart from the English - had fewer halberdiers than pikemen and, as the century progressed, these became increasing associated with guardsmen and sergeants rather than the ordinary rank and file.

Sword & buckler – The Spanish alternative to halberdiers as a means of exploiting the gaps in a disordered pike block, sword & buckler men could also be found in relatively small numbers in some Italian armies and also among the Scottish highlanders. Swordsmen may have been more effective than halberdiers against disordered pikemen, but they were also far more vulnerable to cavalry.

Crossbow – Almost as slow to load as an arquebus, the crossbow was arguably more accurate and may have had a longer effective range. However, it was less effective against armoured targets. Nevertheless, the main reason for the abandonment of the crossbow, may have been less a matter of relative battlefield effectiveness as the fact that the crossbow was, technically, a far more complex weapon requiring a number of carefully hand-crafted parts, and thus more expensive to produce than a firearm, which was basically just a metal tube mounted on a wooden stock.

Arquebus – The 16th century arquebus is in fact closer in calibre and weight to the 18th century musket than the heavier 16th century musket, which required a forked rest. Slow loading and inaccurate compared with the English longbow, the arquebus was more effective against armoured targets, as only the very best armour was reputedly “arquebus-proof”.

Musket – Appearing from about the 1540s onwards, the 16th century musket was heavier and more cumbersome than the arquebus, but with a longer range and greater velocity. Requiring a forked rest to fire, this is a significantly heavier weapon than the 18th century musket, which could afford to become lighter once armour was abandoned.

Longbow – English / Scottish armies only. Fast firing, and able to employ indirect fire, the longbow was particularly effective against horses and unarmoured infantry. However, it was significantly less effective than firearms against armoured targets. Also archers were liable to have ammo problems, partly due to their much greater rate or fire, but also because arrows are a lot bulkier than bullets & powder. Consequently, English and Scottish armies, neither of which had many units equipped with firearms, have a significantly higher ammo loss probability.

Shortbow – Irish Kern, rebels, militia, etc, - a less effective weapon than the longbow, with a shorter range. But it is still a useful weapon against unarmoured targets.

Rifle – Rifling is said to have originated in Augsburg around 1498. Some arquebuses and muskets were certainly rifled, but there is no clear evidence of entire units being armed with rifled firearms before c.1600.

Non-Combatants – Camp followers and other non-combatants are invariable present in Renaissance armies. In some cases they’re fanatical and take an active part in the battle, although most of the time it’s best to keep them safely in the rear, along with the baggage train, since they’re liable to rout at the first shot and are quite likely to take other troops with them. They are usually armed with “javelins”, which may represent a variety of other improvised missiles.


Artillery
Renaissance artillery ranges in calibre from heavy siege guns down to ultra light pieces of barely greater calibre than the heavy fork-rest musket. The heavier guns are very slow moving, require “set up” before being able to fire, and are generally incapable of defensive fire.

A Cannon
A heavy siege gun, this was a slow-loading, virtually immobile gun designed more for battering down walls than for effective use on the battlefield. In some scenarios, notably those involving oriental forces, they’re only permitted to fire a single time due to their very slow reload rate.

C Culverin
Ranging from about an 18pdr upwards, the culverin had limited mobility and would have been more useful in sieges. However, at this period, it was not uncommon to find culverins deployed on the battlefield.

D Demi-Culverin
Approximately a 15pdr gun, the demi-culverin could be used in both sieges and on the battlefield, although perhaps too light to be really effective in the former and too heavy to have much mobility on the battlefield once a battle got under way.

B Saker
A 6-8pdr gun – there was no real standardization of calibre at this period – the saker was intended for use on the battlefield. Despite having a smaller crew, often only one of whom was properly trained, this smoothbore muzzle-loading gun was little different in 1500 from those of two or three hundred years later.

E Falcon
This light 3-4pdr gun was less effective and had a shorter range than the saker. With a well-trained crew and sufficient horses, this might have enjoyed the same mobility and effectiveness of Napoleonic era horse artillery, however, in the Renaissance period it is still normally classified as ordinary foot artillery.

F Falconette
The 1-2pdr falconette is the lightest type of gun, but it’s also the least effective. This gun type is so light that it’s been counted as “horse” artillery, so it can turn and fire or unlimber and fire in the same turn.

G Organ Guns
With five or more small barrels mounted on a single gun carriage, the organ gun was a short ranged infantry support gun intended to help break up a cavalry charge or disrupt the attack of an enemy pike block. It’s the Renaissance equivalent of a mitrailleuse or machine gun.



Espero que os ayude :Ok:
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Vie Mar 13, 2009 10:32 am

Rahamy ya ha publicado la 1ª parte de las notas del juego, para no ser pesado dejo el enlace porque tiene mucho texto :mrgreen:

Por cierto, uno de los que ya tienen el juego me ha mandado una captura (se la pedi y me la mando, buen chaval si señor), la dejo aqui para vuestro deleite :Ok:

Imagen

PD: a ver si llega pronto aunque el ETW tambien llena lo suyo jejeje.
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Mar Mar 24, 2009 8:40 pm

Bueno, me acaba de llegar el juego, lo he instalado y abiero un par de escenarios, a pesar de que graficamente no es una maravilla tiene una pintaza estupenda, mañana ire subiendo algunas imagenes, si teneis alguna peticion especial intentare complirla :Ok:
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por nomada_squadman45 » Mié Mar 25, 2009 8:29 pm

Bueno lo prometido es deuda, algunas imagenes de la batalla de Cerignola, notese el excelente uso del lenguaje de Cervantes por parte de los angloparlantes :mrgreen:

Imagen

Imagen

Imagen

Imagen

Y como en esta batalla no sale aqui os pongo de otra la unidad mas peligrosa de cualquier ejercito, una autentica arma de destruccion masiva, recibe muchos nombres este es solo uno de ellos, la muerte dulce :P

Imagen

Ala espero que lo disfruteis, a ver cuando saco tiempo para jugarlo aunque por ahora con leer los detalles y adaptarme a la epoca me llega :rezar:
"Non vi sed arte, No por la fuerza sino por la astucia", LRDG
"Lo mejor en la vida es estar borracho, y lo segundo mejor es estar salido" Tyrion Lannister, Poeta.

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pailleterie
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Re: Los Tercios según HPS.

Mensaje por pailleterie » Jue Mar 26, 2009 9:15 am

El juego parece interesante, eso si los graficos dejan bastante que desear incluso para ser en 2d.

Gracias por las imagenes, si pudieras mostrar una de ejercitos otomanos. :Ok:

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